Q&A: Talking with Minister Graham Letto

Graham Letto has been the Minister of Municipal Affairs and Environment for two months this January. This is a cleaned up excerpt of the interview that was conducted Tuesday, Jan. 8, 2019, by phone.

Plastic and microplastics are recognized as dangers to the environment in Newfoundland culture. Minister Graham Letto talks about what the provincial government is doing. Melissa Wong/My Online Journalism Blog

By Melissa Wong
My Online Journalism Blog

January 10, 2019


Minister Graham Letto: I am calling from my office in the Confederation building

Melissa Wong: What is Newfoundland’s provincial government’s stance on plastic bags? 
GL: We have certainly not ruled out a ban on plastic bags. Although we are doing a lot of research on it. We are looking closely at how the province of Prince Edward Island brought in a ban just recently, so we are looking at that model. What we have done so far I guess, ah, is back in September, before I became minister here, ah, we pulled together representatives from Industry, regional communities and government to have a discussion around this and everybody present of course would like to see a reduction in the use of plastic bags and better rates of reuse and recycling and recovery so we have not ruled out the ban and we have not- close to this point decided to have one. Although we are seriously considering our options, but and which way to go with it. What we have to remember of course, as well, is that while plastic bags seems to be one of the- probably one of the worst things we see in the environment, it is very high profile, it is a very small percentage of the actual plastic waste stream ah, but having said that, though it is so small it still gets a lot of publicity because of its high profile that it creates, ah, in the environment and certainly when you look at trees and areas that surround areas around waste management sites you’ll see a lot of ah, plastic bags stuck in fences and of course you cannot forget as well – through the marine life. And it seems to be one of the worst perpetrators to marine life and marine mammals to be some of the things they digest so we understand that… that it's something that is very public and very high profile and it’s getting a lot of attention. Of course, you are aware that Municipalities Newfoundland and Labrador has called for – is advocating for a provincial ban for some time now. They have passed resolutions at their annual conventions and we are working with them. They are one of our stakeholders that we are working with to make a decision here, so there is a lot of work being done on it in the department of environment. We are not ready to – at this point we are not ready to say yes or no to a ban but this is something that is under very – under high priority and is under a lot of consideration up to this point.

MW: The meeting that you mentioned- is that the September 24 meeting?
GL: Yes… yes.

MW: Where was that located again?
GL: That was here in… that was before I became Minister, I wasn’t part of that meeting. It was done by the previous minister, but I understand it was here in the Department of Municipal Affairs and Environment. 

MW: I believe that you did meet with the municipalities.
GL: Yes… we met with the board of directors of the municipalities NL where we discussed this issue among other issues- other municipal issues. But this was one we had discussed we understand fully where they are coming from and their position on this. They are very strong in their avocation for a provincial ban. Because I think there are five communities around the province that have implemented the municipal ban. But when you get into that- it's not, province-wide and I think there are five municipalities including Fogo Island and four communities on the north coast of Labrador that have implemented their own ban.  I saw in the news this morning there’s a couple of cities in the Maritimes that are considering it. Halifax, Monkton… again, rather than different towns and different cities doing different things, it certainly would be more advantageous and probably have a higher rate of success, if it's something is done provincially. That’s the position MNL has taken regards to this. They want to see it done by the province rather than individual municipalities.

MW: I spoke to the Retail Council and they appear to want laws that allow for a level playing field.
GL: I agree with them. I think it would be much better, and more successful if there where a provincial ban rather than individual towns and municipalities. I certainly concur with that.

MW: Why is the provincial government undecided about what to do about the plastic bag situation?
GL: Why are we undecided? Well ah, first of all, I am a new minister I don’t want to go out and be making ah, making a provincial ban without getting all the information I need that is what I am doing at this point. I am not ready to make that decision we have not gotten all the information that I need, but we are getting closer and not everybody- not everybody agrees with this. We have to make sure what we are doing, people will buy into it and because only if people – the only way it's going to be successful is if people adhere to the regulations. If we bring in regulations the best way we go with it, but unless people are supportive of it is not going to work. That is why we need to make sure we have all the information in place. And any strategy that we roll out we have to make sure that it is doable and that it will garner a high range of success and that is where we are.   

MW: Who doesn’t agree?
GL: There is a lot of people that do not agree. A lot of people use these bags for different reasons they get a lot of secondary use. The retailers have some concerns with it – if we banned the bag what would we replace it with? Do we charge a fee? So there is a lot of issues that we need to make sure we have to resolve before we move forward. We don’t want to move forward on a ban that we don’t have all the “T”s crossed and the “I”s dotted and make sure- I want it to be successful so I want to make sure that as many people are supportive of it and ah, the money issues, of course, is around- around the retailers and ah, but you know, we are working with them as well. Not all retailers disagree with it there is some- when you – I know that for instance Walmart right now- if you go to Walmart you will get charged- I think it is five cents per bag that you use. And of course, then there are the reusable, recyclable bags that… like Sobey’s and Dominion and other grocery outlets would have ah, but they are still using plastic bags and there are more people of course going to recyclable, reusable bags all the time so I think it's starting to catch on and the retailers are seeing that and - but that’s what we need to do. We need to get as many people as possible on our side so that we can – so that it will be successful.

MW: I spoke to the head of the retail council and MNL president. The retail council said they would not mind a ban as long as all on a level playing field.
GL: That is true. That was one of the concerns that were raised at the meeting that we had back in September...

MW: They are not necessary against a ban, they are against a ban that creates an uneven playing field like patchwork municipalities… that is why they want a provincial ban or some other regulation fair for all retailers.
GL: And we’ve received letters from the Canadian Federation of independent groceries as well. It's one thing- it's not only big stores we have to be concerned about its also the smaller convenience stores that use them as well, right. It’s not only- the Sobey’s and the Dominions of the world and the Wall Marts of the world we got to look at the smaller, the independent businesses and they certainly raised some concerns… they may want a reduction…(or a) complete ban. It's one of the things I am pondering over when we do bring up – if and when we do bring in a ban so we do it in stages. Do we say we target 25% the first year, 50% in the third year or second year and a full ban the third year? These are all the things we are considering at this point. And these are the things we have yet to bring back to these groups. We are putting together a submission now to take back to these organizations and to have them look at something that we may have in mind to um, to move forward with this. But ah, we understand that it is certainly something that we have to make a decision on and we will but I want as I said I want to make sure that we have all the information and that proper conciliation has been done with all groups that would be impacted by such a ban.  

MW: You are currently just looking for information on the main issue, but realistically what obstacles does the NL province have to face? 
GL: I don’t think there are any obstacles as such if we want to make a ban we can do it today. I don’t think there would be any obstacles, I mean whatever we say has to be written into legislation and into law. I mean you would have some upset people I am sure but, that is why we need to do this carefully… I don’t want to rush into this as a new minister- rushing into this and putting something in place that people are going to rebel against and- and you know and fail before we even get started. I want to put something that I feel can – the organizations and the province can buy into and support… If we want to do this, I don’t want to... see any obstacles. It’s just that I want to make sure it’s done to the conciliation with the affected organizations and make sure that it's going to work for us.

MW: What about enforcement of the ban? How much thought has been put into that?
GL: That’s one of the issues isn’t it? … We can have all the laws and legislation in place if we want and no means of enforcing it, then it’s not worth the paper it’s written on. So, that’s one of the issues we… have to take into consideration because once the ban is brought in who – for one thing, who enforces it and how do we enforce it? … Is it through a voluntary process- or is it through- I mean I don’t want to strong arm anyone either I mean these are all the things we take into consideration as we speak. That is why we are taking their time with this that is why there is not a ban in place today, we have to consider all the questions they are asking. We have to have answers for them cause that’s the first thing that is going to be asked when we bring in a ban, how are we going to enforce it? And we have to have a means of enforcing it in place. The first day that any ban is implemented. a mechanism must be in place to make sure that it works… That’s the big questions that have to be answered before we move forward with this.

MW: There are many different solutions how far are you along with that?
GL: We are getting there… I think there will be decisions made early in 2019 now. It will certainly be made early in the first half of this year. When we should be in a position to make a decision on this.

MW: So, in 2019 there will be some sort of legislation implemented?
GL: No, no legislation... There will be a decision about which way we are going to go with this if we go at all. So, the decisions will be made... this year absolutely. I would venture to say the first half of the year.

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